HOW TO PICK THE BEST SURVEYOR
FOR YOU and YOUR BOAT

By Bert W. Quay, AMS #204 ©2001

6 QUICK STEPS TO YOUR PICK

Get the brokers' and boatyards lists of local surveyors.
Check the national surveyor associations list for the prospects' professional qualifications first.
Look for a pre-purchase surveyor who specializes in the type of boat you're buying.
Ask what the survey covers and how detailed it will be.
Screen for experience and physical capability.
Choose for Independence and mutual trust.

"Last week, I couldn't even spell "SIRVAYER," now I get to be one!"

The bell curve of qualities and qualifications holds for surveyors. They are like any other group of practitioners. A few will have a fortunate blend of quality characteristics that will make your survey interesting, entertaining, rewarding, and memorable. Most surveyors will do an average job, working routinely through the process, providing ordinary value which you will more or less appreciate. And at the bottom end, a few surveyors will be pretenders or idiots, turning out work that is insulting, utterly useless, or completely mis-leading, which you'll try to forget.

So obviously, "Caveat Emptor" applies to picking a surveyor as much as to buying a boat.

Some surveyors have real experience and knowledge, while others are just faking or lazing their way through with a few pet complaints that they apply to every boat. Some have real credentials, but some have just memberships. Some want to do the survey work, while others just want to "be a surveyor."
Some will work hard, and others will hardly work. Some will spend all day, and others will barely spend the morning. Some don't mind the sweat and dirt of the bilge or engine room, but others will finish the survey still clean and crisp. Some are very practical and hands-on, while others are bookish and hands-off.
Some surveyors are full-time, others are just looking to fill some spare time. Some are working to build a reputation and practice for the long run, while others are just trying to pick up a few bucks to supplement their retirement. Some are intense about their service, others just want a "position" that lets them hang around boats.
Some will see all the details, and others will miss nearly everything. Some are carefully methodical thorough and tenacious in looking into and under everything they can, while others are satisfied with their first quick glance. Some understand what they see, but others don't have a clue about the causes or consequences of their observations.
Some are humble and inquisitive, while others are just "know-it-alls." Some are interested in providing you good service, but others are just in it just to satisfy whatever ego trip drives them. Some like the people who buy boats, but others would rather be left alone while they work.
Some surveyors can communicate what they see in plain language, while others can barely string 3 sentences together without archaic nautical language or pseudo-technibabble. Some are teachers who want you to know about the boat, but others have no concern for either the boat or you.
Some have sea sense, and others just know a lot of "regulations and standards." Some are trying to help you with your decision, while others trying to be the "purchase police" to inflate their own importance. Some have a "tough love" for the boat, and others just get joy from criticizing it.
Some are working for you and for the truth, while others are working for the broker, but charging you. Some charge a high fee and more than earn it, while others know what they're worth and charge a cut-rate price.

And in case you haven't figured it out, you want to pick the guy who is described in the first part of all the above sentences!

THE OFFER'S BEEN ACCEPTED. LET'S SET UP THE SURVEY!

Once your offer is accepted, you're anxious to get on with the next step, which is to meet the conditions of the contract for a survey, sea trials, and financing, plus insurance.

Often, the broker is your only source of information about how to proceed and who to call to get it done. And some brokers will try to "package" the survey and haulout, financing, and insurance referrals, even to the point of quoting prices. That makes it easier on you when you're operating without independent sources of contacts. And it makes the path to closing for the broker a lot more certain.

Some brokers are scrupulously honest and thoroughly professional. They have made a knowledgeable presentation of the boat. So, they refer only the best surveyors, because they want the best possible inspection and the happiest possible client. On the other hand, a broker acquaintance once admitted that one local surveyor was so ridiculously easy that none of the brokers in his office could afford to use anybody else.

"Buyer beware" at every stage of the purchase process is a prudent stance. You can become so paranoid about "a brokers surveyor" that you end up making the self-defeating decision to avoid every name that the broker gives you. It's not that you don't accept the broker's referrals, it's just that you need to check them out for yourself, and make the decision for yourself.

And it's quite possible that the guy on the top of the broker's list is also the most qualified and the most personable to boot.

ROUND UP SOME LIKELY SUSPECTS

THE BROKER'S LIST

The first step in getting the right surveyor is finding 2 or 4 to pick from. The listing broker will be the first source of names.

Every broker has a list of local surveyors that they give to buyers. When you don't really know the broker, you can't really tell much about the surveyors from their referral. Being that they work in an adversarial marketplace, some brokers protect their commission by putting only the weakest surveyors on their list. Some brokers will recommend only 1 surveyor, and others will give you several.

The practical problem is that you don't know who to pick from the broker's list. So usually, the broker will give you the list without recommendation to cover their liability exposure, but then point or otherwise indicate their preference on the list. But rather than pushing the broker for a specific recommendation or throwing yourself on his mercy, you should take the step of screening them yourself.

There is no inherent ethical problem with brokers listing or recommending surveyors. But there are more than enough instances where the broker has a "house surveyor" he knows will try to "close the deal" in return for a continued flow of referrals, that some skepticism about the broker's list is justified.

The worst case I know is where a broker knew a retiree with no professional credentials who just wanted to pick up some part-time money doing "surveys." The brokerage "created" their own house surveyor by getting him to pay minimal membership dues to an association that didn't require any testing for admission, so that they could "use" him for surveys. The last time I checked, the brokers didn't even know what the guy's membership was, but they were busy recommending him to their buyers.

Instead of throwing the involved broker's referrals away, you should call some other local brokers for their recommendations too. Brokers who aren't part of your purchase path will often recommend the toughest surveyors around (maybe in hopes of killing a competitor's deal).

THE ASSOCIATION ROSTER

The simplest way to access full lists of accredited or certified surveyors is by going to the association web sites. You can click on SAMS or call 1-800/344-0977 for a list of SAMS members. And you can click on NAMS or call 1-800/822-6267 for a list of NAMS members.
This will give you an "un-tainted" list to work with. Both lists will give you an indication of the surveyor's specialties, so you don't bother to call somebody who does hull and cargo or marine facility surveys when you need a sailboat inspection.
And if a name is not on the association list, then cross it off your list, no matter who made the "recommendation." There simply are too many qualified and certified surveyors on the lists to even consider some local yahoo who isn't a tested professional.

BOATYARDS and OTHER SOURCES

Boatyards and marinas have no interest in your purchase, so their referrals will not be biased by having an interest in the outcome of the survey. But conversely, they usually have little to no knowledge about the surveyor's work other than the rankest kind of scuttlebutt.

The marine lending company or local bank may be able to give you additional names or recommend one out of your list. Similarly, the local insurance agency may have somebody they like. But again, the paper handlers don't really know much about surveyors beyond the fact that the report looks pretty good. They don't get to the boat to actually see the surveyor work, so their referral is made "from a distance."

If you are buying locally, obviously you can ask along the docks or at the yacht club for opinions. And I expect you'll get some pretty lively endorsements and condemnations, probably some of both for every candidate.

Boat/US is one of the primary marine insurers and lenders in the US. It has a surveyor referral program that will provide you a list of surveyors who have registered with the Association as offering the service. You can refine your search by asking for the names of the 2 or 3 "recommended" surveyors in each state or area.

GIVE YOUR SEARCH ENOUGH TIME TO WORK

It is important to ask the brokers which surveyors specialize in the type of boat you're buying. So for instance, as a sportfish boat buyer, you can screen out the sailboat surveyors at this referral stage. Then ask the brokers to characterize the surveyor's work and style.
At this point, you will have asked more questions than most buyers, who are still over-excited at the prospect of getting the boat they've wanted to be doing any quality search for a surveyor.
Don't be in a rush to set the survey up immediately. Don't ask the broker to set the survey up for you. And don't go back to your room and play dial-a-surveyor, looking for "the first available" who doesn't have any work. Because all that impatience is self-defeating.
Take the time to call two or three surveyors and let them get back to you. The best ones are in the bilge during the day, and don't want to be interrupted when they're consulting with a client (just like you don't want to be when it's your survey day).

CHECKING OUT THE PROSPECTS

MIS-DIRECTED "CONSUMERISM"

The process of screening several prospects is not a matter of requesting resumes or copies of survey reports to compare. Despite Boat/US's endorsement of this strategy, scrupulous surveyors as well as the surveyor associations consider it poor form to supply a copies of somebody else's confidential, custom survey report to some stranger who calls on the phone.
At best, the resume and sample report strategy is a sort of false consumerism that fools skittish buyers into thinking they've made a rational choice, when in truth they don't know enough about boats, surveying, or real credentials to tell a seasoned surveyor from a wannabe. At worst, it's a method that will disqualify YOU in the eyes of the best surveyors, who will oddly be booked up when you want a survey.
But more importantly to you, most of the telling, real-world criteria of choice won't appear on a resume and can't be discerned from a report.
You don't have to put the surveyor on the rack and interrogate him. You can just talk with him a little to find out what really matters. And to heck with being timid about asking "politically incorrect" or "personally insensitive" questions.

PROFESSIONAL CREDENTIALS . . .NOT JUST MEMBERSHIPS

The first qualification is full certification by a nationally recognized surveyor association. Unlike real estate inspectors and appraisers, or claims adjusters, there is no state or national licensing for surveyors. There are too few in the practice to make it worthwhile for the state to gear up to collect the fees.

So surveyors have formed professional associations to provide credentials, education, and mutual support for their members. To survey clients, the associations provide assurance of basic qualifications.

The original surveyor society was NAMS, the National Association of Marine Surveyors, formed in 1962. It was primarily oriented toward ships, cargo, and damage claim surveyors, many of whom were engineers. NAMS has fewer than 500 members.

To meet the rapid growth in numbers and types of production fiberglass pleasure boats, SAMS, the Society of Accredited Marine Surveyors, was formed in the late 1980s. It was primarily oriented toward yachts and small craft surveyors, very few of whom were engineers. SAMS has more than 900 members.

Neither group is necessarily "better" than the other, and neither has members who are necessarily better surveyors than the other. Each has a fair amount of pride in their approach, and each attracts members who are in tune with its philosophy of admission, training, and advancement.

Both associations have a fully accredited or certified level of membership for established surveyors. The surveyor must have a minimum of 5 years surveying experience, and after a review of survey reports, recommendations, and an interview by the membership committee, each applicant must pass a difficult and detailed, day-long written test on applicable technical and safety standards.

Since a person cannot become a real surveyor overnight or without considerable study, both societies have an associate membership for people working their way into the profession.

Fully accredited or certified surveyors, as well as associates, are listed by the associations in their membership directories, so you need to realize the difference in qualifications. You can't just pick any name off the list and think you're going to reach a NAMS or SAMS surveyor.

If you get a list of surveyors, look to see their level of certification, any specialties they have, and the date of their accreditation. That way you get a picture of both qualifications and experience.

The first tip that a surveyor is not fully accredited is a business card that says he is a member of SAMS or NAMS, or some other set of initials, along with ABYC or NFPA. That means that he's paid his membership fees, but hasn't qualified yet for tested certification.

If the card or any other literature does not specifically say that the surveyor is accredited or certified by SAMS or NAMS, then you can be sure that he's not.

It's unfortunate that some surveyors are so eager for business, especially when they're just getting started, that they try to supply memberships in lieu of credentials. As we all know, a membership is something that you simply write a check for, so it carries little weight. Credentials must be jurried and tested for qualification, so that any clients are assured by the organization of meaningful minimal competence.

The bottom line is that you want a SAMS Accredited Marine Surveyor (AMS) or a NAMS Certified Marine Surveyor (CMS) unless there is a compelling reason otherwise. Why? Because you can instantly and easily verify their claimed status with a phone call or web site visit.

Occasionally, a surveyor will claim some completely bogus "professional" credential, such as "being on the Lloyds list," or "I built boats in the Caribbean or Taiwan." You should reject those vague references, because you can't check them out yourself, and because the surveyor's work is unlikely to demonstrate any confirmation of those references.

There is absolutely no reason-except laziness, arrogance, crookedness, incompetence, or stupidity- for a person claiming that they have long surveying experience and considerable expertise to not be certified as a professional by either SAMS or NAMS.

There are a few surveying practices that offer apprenticeship opportunities for associate surveyors under the guidance of the senior, accredited surveyor. The apprentices should have their own individual and verifiable membership in NAMS or SAMS while they are gaining experience. Generally, a surveyor associate who is working with an established, accredited surveyor will be as good an onboard inspector as the senior surveyor . . . and much better than an associate struggling to make it on his own.

And today, most marine lenders and underwriters will not accept a report from a surveyor who is not NAMS certified or SAMS accredited. Because they've learned the hard way that the first thing that disintegrates when trouble arises is the report from a non-accredited surveyor.

So let full national certification be your first criteria for selecting a surveyor. Now you're ready to narrow your search with some additional criteria.

SPECIALIZATIONS

LOOK FOR A PURCHASE SURVEYOR

Pre-purchase surveying is the hardest type of survey work. Because it requires the surveyor to get sweaty in the boatyard and dirty in the bilge. Which a lot of "surveyors" don't want to do.

So just ask the surveyor if they do a lot of damage work. Then stay away from them if you can, because that's mostly phone and paper work. A surveyor who came up through the boatyard and still wants to get his hands on things will do a better pre-purchase job for you than somebody who learned the business from the top down without any practical experience. Because surveying is not an executive position.

Occasionally, you'll run into a retiree who wants to be a surveyor, but who doesn't want to do any real surveying when it's work. I honestly don't know how you steer around those folks, except to just ask if the prospect plans on getting dirty. Or maybe you can judge by what he intends to cover in the inspection.

Once you've cleared the certification hurdle, the primary qualification is the surveyor's independence. That's something that no resume or other credentials can establish.

EXPERIENCE AND INTEREST IN YOUR TYPE OF BOAT

Up to a point, fiberglass is fiberglass, equipment is equipment, and the surveyor is the ultimate marine generalist, so a good surveyor can inspect most any kind of boat. And through the years, he will have looked at all kinds.

Still, most surveyors have interests and experience with 2 or 3 particular types of boats. And it's common for sailboat surveyors to have stayed clear of powerboats, and for sportfish guys to have steered clear of sailboats. Some surveying practices have two or three members on staff who are assigned work according to their differing specialty skills and experience. If the surveyor's preference and experience doesn't come out in conversation, just ask about it.

You'll be more comfortable with a pre-purchase surveyor who likes the type of boat you're buying. So find a guy who talks the specialized lingo of the sport you're buying into.

PHYSICAL STAMINA, AGILITY, AND SIZE

A thorough survey requires a surprising amount of physical work to accomplish, whether it's climbing and moving the tall ladder to tap the topsides, getting up and down the companionway when the steps are removed, whether it's lifting hatches and fish boxes, or crawling under the cockpit to reach the rudder heads. At the end of 6 or 7 hours, with winter layers on, or in the humid heat of summer, a good surveyor will be tired.

So the work is not for the overweight, weak, or out-of-shape. Neither is it for the large-framed, because the engine rooms, lazarettes, and cockpit lockers are being crammed with more equipment these days than ever before, leaving almost nothing for even the slightest of inspectors.

You ought to throw interpersonal sensitivity and political correctness in the trash can and tactfully find out how long the prospect has been surveying, so you get some idea about both his experience and age. Just ask when he started surveying, how he got into it, and what he did before he started. Remember that you're looking for someone who is mature and experienced, but not retired.

FIND OUT WHAT THE SURVEY WILL COVER

This is the question that often picks the surveyor for you. You can tell if the inspection will be thorough and complete. You can tell what the surveyor's standards for deficiencies will be. You can tell if this will be a detailed survey or just the big picture.

You're not looking to hold the surveyor to every line item in a checklist, but to see if he has a checklist that insures a satisfactory level of detailed inspection.

THE INTANGIBLES COUNT MOST

INDEPENDENCE

When it comes to ethics in surveying, INDEPENDENCE IS EVERYTHING!
And too many surveyors are so interested in getting their next client by playing up to the broker, that they don't do a good enough job for their current one. They are more interested in the business of surveying than in the practice of surveying.
Surveyors have to withstand repeated attempts by a variety of "self-interested" players to influence his findings and interpretations. And a starving surveyor is relatively weak against outside pressures.
You are just one client to a hungry surveyor. Even if he does a good job for you, he won't reap any word-of-mouth referral business from you for awhile, and won't get repeat business from you for several years. But the brokers who refer him can be an immediate, steady source of clients, as long as he seems to sugar-coat any problems with reassuring labels.

TRUST

When you get ready to finally settle on a surveyor, talk seriously with him about the fact that he is working for you. If he's willing to over-value the boat to eliminate your down-payment, or to mis-represent some findings to help you beat the price down, then cross him off the list. If he won't stand up to your demands, then he's not independent enough to do you much good. Because no hired gun is to be trusted.

The essence of the surveyor/ buyer relationship is mutual trust. If you naturally distrust everyone, then you're going to have a hard time with any surveyor. And any good surveyor is going to have a hard time with you. Don't expect the surveyor to be trustworthy if you aren't. You should be trying to rent the surveyor, not buy him.

ANY PREJUDICES?

You want the surveyor's opinion, but you want that opinion to be objective, professional, and informed rather than biased. Because you can get un-informed, amateur prejudice most anywhere along the docks.

I am surprised at how eager some surveyors are to express their disdain for certain types of boats. So just ask the surveyor point blank if he has any pre-conceived dislike for the boat you're buying, or if he feels he can give it an objective look for you.

Some of the over-eager opinions about what boats are good and what ones are not is mere egotism. When you're buying a $100,000 Taiwan trawler with teak decks, you don't need a Hatteras snob looking it over with an air of open disgust because it's not a million dollar yacht.

ADDRESS YOUR CONCERNS

You can in effect "try the surveyor out" by bringing up a couple of your concerns about the boat. His response should be an explanation of how he will proceed to check these out for you. And not a diatribe about what a bad boat you're considering. It's a strike against the prospect if he's too quick with a sure answer before he's even seen the boat.

HOW TO PICK THE BEST SURVEYOR FOR YOU and YOUR BOAT